...
written by dhood , November 21, 2008 (08:44:12 AM)

By making the wrong choice even just once he put everyone he associated with in jeopardy. Even with these guys in jail doesn't mean you are in the clear. Look what happened to Brittany and Garett. The suspects in the "shooting Victim" case were in jail when they were murdered. I can't say it often enough, know who your friends REALLY are and NOT just faces on some internet site.

Here we go again
written by Claymor , November 21, 2008 (09:09:19 AM)

This was thoroughly gone over in response to the November 19 headline "Judge Reserves Decision ..". Assuming you are the same mother as "dealingwithit" in that post, you might want to go back and read the exchange there. To summarize:

First, if events had turned out differently, and the deceased was the murderer, or if the deceased was convicted for trafficking, you and his defence lawyer would be making exactly the same arguments to minimize his sentence as we are hearing for these four accused.

Second, one who is willingly involved in a criminal enterprise where murder is a management technique knows the risks and ought not to be memorialized for the predictable consequences of his choices.

Third, I am still waiting to hear how much compassion the deceased and his supporters had for the victims of the drugs he traded, including the addicts, those who cared about the addicts, those who were robbed or otherwise brutalized by the addicts, etc. Regardless of the deceased's prior life or prior character, there is nothing defensible about trafficking drugs.

You and his family have our sympathy, but you won't find any support for drug dealers around here.

Yes here we go again
written by dealingwithit , November 21, 2008 (01:00:39 PM)

Claymor, I dont care what your opinion is, I know Thomas, did the people have compassion for him when they dealt him drugs to ruin his life?? No, all they wanted was the money. I know how the drug world, I lived with an addict for 5 years of my life, me myself do not do drugs, and never really cared for them. But when you love someone with a problem, you try your hardest to protect them. When he was up in Dawson Creek I lived in Kelowna, I was nowhere near him to kick his butt for dealing misery to other people. I do not believe in the drug trade it sickens me to know people do this to others, yes all drug dealers care about is getting more and more money. I do feel sorry for everyone that is addicted to drugs, I wish there was a way I could help them, but there isnt. I feel sorry for people that love or care for an addict. Dont get my wrong, I am not saying what Thomas did for the last few months of his life was the best choice of his. I totally disagree with what he did, and he knows it, so he kept me out of it, and wouldnt tell me what he was doing, but I knew cause I know him. Secondly, I do feel sorry for the accused families, they are going through almost what I am going through, except their children live on, Thomas doesnt. He could have just been honest about everything, and I would probably have gotten into my vehicle with my children, and headed up to Dawson Creek to bail him out of the problem he was in, but I didnt know. I am terrified to death that these guys will come after me and mostly my children, as I have twin boys that look exactly like their father, and have had nightmares that this happens. So yes I dont feel safe anywhere I go. I feel sorry for everyone that has is addicted to any type of drug, cause I know what it does to people. I wish the cops would be a little tougher on those who deal drugs..I dont want those drugs to end up in childrens hands..I am not only concerned about them getting out in a few years because what happened to Thomas (and myself) but as a mother, I am terrified to know that people that have manslaughter charges from before still get to walk the streets. Who is to say Thomas is the last one they kill?? I have moved far away from BC, and dont plan to move back there anytime soon, my next move will be somewhere they cant find me. Knowing they know what my children and I look like makes me even more terrified. Thomas was a good man, he wanted away from Dawson Creek, he wanted to start a clean life away from all that. He probably didnt even realize the damage he did to people by selling them whatever drug it is he sold. When you are an addict yourself, you think by selling another addict drugs you are helping that person out. You and I know differently, but seeing it from a drug dealers/addicts perspective, its a whole lot different. I dont mind peoples opinions, cause I know the type of person Thomas was, and he was never there to hurt or inflict pain on anyone...You can say that he is a terrible person all you want, cause he sold drugs for a few months, but I know differently so really if you want to cut a person down that you dont even know keep it to yourself just cause he was a drug dealer doesnt make him any less of a person then you. So just remember that.
I have talked to the courts to see if I can have one on one time with the accused, If i didnt care what they had to say I wouldnt have bothered asking, but something some strong feeling came over me telling me I had to ask. So I am taking that step in trying to face them, see what they have to say. It scares me, cause then they have a closer look at me, but its something I have to do.

...
written by dealingwithit , November 21, 2008 (01:10:12 PM)

Oh and if the deceased was the one that murdered, I would still be at court, shaking my head in tears. I would feel terrible for the family, just like the accused families feel bad. But see Thomas wasnt a murderer, I never saw him EVER beat up a person let alone kill someone. My biggest problem with everything is that, Thomas was not a big guy, he maybe weighed 150lbs one guy alone weighs 200lbs, they are all big guys, it wouldnt have taken 4 guys to beat Thomas up, it would have taken one. So my problem with being able to see this crime as a manslaughter is that there were 4 guys probably totalling a weight of 800lbs approx taking on one guy that weighed 150lbs..then having a van parked outside to drag him to, and having the chain saw and gasoline in the back just seems to me that it was more planned then they say. Anyone could look shocked at someones death, especially if they thought it would have taken more then 30 minutes to kill him. And just the thought that his face and hands were cut off is disgusting, then they burn him in the mans van that walks free and clear these days. No I dont feel safe, I want to curl up under a rock with my children and hide...

Don't
written by Claymor , November 22, 2008 (11:42:56 PM)

Dealingwithit, it won't do any good to try and figure these events out rationally. The violence is incomprehensible. Better to just try and let time take it's course.

The deal with the crown accepting the manslaughter plea is just that in the professional judgment of the crown prosecutors, it was overall better to accept a certain conviction for manslaughter rather than go through a difficult and very expensive trial on a higher charge that might have resulted in acquittals. It might seem clear that the incidents were intentional, and they probably were, but there's no percentage in turning down a sure thing. So the perpetrators are convicted and will do some time. Let it go at that.

There's nothing to be gained by a face-to-face with these guys either. I would expect you're pretty safe unless you provoke them. But the hard truth is, you know who exposed you to all this. The best response may just be to use this whole thing as an illustration of what can go wrong when one gets mixed up in the drug industry.

Good luck to you and your kids. I have a happy and successful friend who was in similar situations years ago, so I know you and your kids can be okay if you stick together and help each other through.

Claymor, shut up
written by grassick , November 23, 2008 (07:38:23 AM)

I would never even think of commenting on this one out of respect, but Claymor someone obviously needs to slap you and unless you have similar experience and can constructively share that experience, shut the hell up.
Your assessment of why the crown chose to do this or that is obvious you are oblivious to the pain some are going through so just shut up and comment on something else.
Just because you have a friend doesn't make you an expert because you have no clue what some are going through right now no matter what the circumstances. The facts are some brutal murderers got off easy. Easy to see not ever easy for anyone to understand or rationalize. Claymor, do everyone a favor and do not comment on this one if you have any sense of decency.

Right on Grassick!
written by Claymor , November 23, 2008 (11:42:48 AM)

Entertaining as always Grassick, tho' you might want to get someone to explain the posts to you before you start venting.

It's called proofreading Claymor
written by grassick , November 23, 2008 (03:18:38 PM)

Poor Claymor, you truly are clueless.
You contradict yourself in the same post, but alas there is people who read this comments who can help you poor wretches such as yourself, Proof read your comments. You can actually edit and make them make a bit more sense:

"it won't do any good to try and figure these events out rationally. "

Yet you try to rationalize these events in the same post:

" But the hard truth is, you know who exposed you to all this."

I really don't like explaining posts to the same people who wrote them, but you obviously need a little special attention.

Grammar, grassick, grammar
written by Claymor , November 23, 2008 (03:53:41 PM)

Yes, grassick, proofreading is good. So since "people" is plural, you should write "alas there are people", not "alas there is people". And your analysis is still hopeless.

@ Claymor, poor Claymor
written by grassick , November 23, 2008 (05:39:29 PM)

wow, weak, Claymor. you pick on my grammar and you failed to read two words further and point out my further mistake, I guess you possess a very short attention span. Kinda explains most of your comments on this site. Is that darn good nuff gramma fro ya.

It may be hard for people such as yourself to ever comprehend why some people end up involved in drugs and crime as you have no doubt been coddled and shielded from the real world for your entire life.
Just read what dealingwithit's first sentence of her first post and that's how everyone feels about you. "Claymor, I dont care what your opinion is,"

You truly are hopeless, Claymor. No one cares about you Claymor not even domesticated animals.

Say goodnight
written by Claymor , November 23, 2008 (06:00:01 PM)

Sorry grassick, life is too short to track all your mistakes. So nighty-night now, and may the dawn on your planet signal a better day tomorrow.

Were you a bad little Claymor?
written by grassick , November 23, 2008 (06:31:25 PM)

It's ok Claymor, I knew you didn't have it in you.
Past your bed time I guess.

Nice try
written by Claymor , November 23, 2008 (06:47:10 PM)

As usual grassik, you don't get it. I'm sending you to bed. You've had a big day but now the adults have other things to do. So just kiss your puppy good night and dream of your nice visit to planet earth.

...
written by dhood , November 25, 2008 (09:48:01 AM)

Now that the kids are in bed maybe we can have an adult conversation.
I beg you "dealinwithit", DO NOT put yourself out there by facing these guys. Who knows if they have friends who might be offended for some reason. It's your duty to the children to find a safe place away from any connection to them. I honestly don't know if it's possible but try for the children's sake. Good luck to all of you.

...
written by Tessa , November 26, 2008 (08:27:39 AM)

Thanks dhood, I often wonder why people have to take these forums and start name calling at each other. Shows a lot of maturity. I have to agree with dhood “dealinwithit", don’t approach these guys they don’t need to know anymore about you then they already do. You and your kids are the important ones. Good luck and be safe.